Travelguard silver insurance purchased too late by our travel agent to cover preexisting conditions

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Carol Phillips

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 28, 2014
1,250
1,715
113
Coastal South Carolina
#61
Working on the timeline and putting all the info together. It is going to take me til tomorrow to put it all together. Just letting you know it will be in chronological order. I am detailed oriented, everything I will include I either have printed off or in an email. As you can tell I have never been in a Forum before.
I second what @mmb said .... you are being very responsive to our requests, and we thank you for that.
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
8,417
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San Francisco
#62
We provide the brochure or website, but we don't fill anything out with the clients either. We always recommend calling the toll free number and paying by phone. Any questions are to be asked of the insurance company. I do assist with any paperwork from our agency should they have to file a claim.
Bodega, this seems to be the only proper way to handle trip insurance and keep everybody happy. I would not expect a travel agent to be able to advise me on the fine print of a policy, I'd look to the company or a broker for that information.
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
8,417
8,527
113
San Francisco
#63
Working on the timeline and putting all the info together. It is going to take me til tomorrow to put it all together. Just letting you know it will be in chronological order. I am detailed oriented, everything I will include I either have printed off or in an email. As you can tell I have never been in a Forum before.
Toby, I'm really looking forward to reading your case once it's all organized, thank you for doing this.
 
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bodega3

Guest
#64
Bodega, this seems to be the only proper way to handle trip insurance and keep everybody happy. I would not expect a travel agent to be able to advise me on the fine print of a policy, I'd look to the company or a broker for that information.
When the bottom line is that insurance companies don't wish to pay out unless they have to, it is too risky to be the go between regarding questions. We get paid less if clients book by phone but it is worth it as then I know the client's questions have been answered by the company and I haven't misinterpreted anything by being the middle person.
 

JVillegirl541

Verified Member
Nov 21, 2014
3,722
3,607
113
#65
Once again I'm sick and tired of being nice!

What is the Credit card date??? Is it 9/2 or 9/3 and specifically what information did the Travel Insurance company use to decline, was it the Credit Card date or the Regent Invoice????

How hard can this answer be! This answer will allow the "Travel Experts" on this sight to then know what direction to go with our poster!

Let's start here and this question has been asked by me repeatedly and also by others.
Absolutely done and I don't care how rude this sounds.
Do not give us what you think we Need to know about, that has been the issue with this entire story and makes it less than believable.
 
Likes: LaurieB
Sep 6, 2015
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#67
Wow, now this is a totally different story. Why did you cancel the initial insurance you purchased?
By witholding this information from us in your initial contact here, we now have a totally different view of what happened and now I can't blame the agent- you bear most of the responsibility because you had a policy, canceled it and didn't notify the agent in a timely manner if the agency's letter is correct.
Knowing she was going on vacation, you should have picked up the phone and called her to make sure she got your message. You may have gotten someone else in the office. And you could have purchased the insurance directly as well.
I wish you had given us this story from the beginning because now I don't think the agent did anything wrong. And I see that some of the others who tried to help you feel the same way.
I'm curious why they didn't contact someone else at the travel agency since this was such a time sensitive issue.
 
Jan 8, 2015
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#69
Once again I'm sick and tired of being nice!

What is the Credit card date??? Is it 9/2 or 9/3 and specifically what information did the Travel Insurance company use to decline, was it the Credit Card date or the Regent Invoice????

How hard can this answer be! This answer will allow the "Travel Experts" on this sight to then know what direction to go with our poster!

Let's start here and this question has been asked by me repeatedly and also by others.
Absolutely done and I don't care how rude this sounds.
Do not give us what you think we Need to know about, that has been the issue with this entire story and makes it less than believable.
There is no reason to be mean and or rude with the poster. If you read the last page they clearly said "Yes, I have the credit card statement showing the initial cruise charge on 2/2/2015. Yes, I have the booking statement from Regent showing the initial deposit date of 2/2/2015."
More than 15 days had passed according to the insurance company so the insurance didn't cover their pre-existing condition. The isssue is that the travel company is denying any wrong doing and has incorrect facts, as indicated by the emails which the poster has.
I'm curious as to the 15 day rule and if this means 15 days or 15 working days, or 15 days, not counting holidays, etc.
 
Likes: Realitoes
Sep 6, 2015
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#70
Toby, why did you tell the agent you didn't want the Allianz Insurance? You have 10 days from the date of purchase to cancel - you could have held that policy open if you wanted to look at other policies and canceled it for a refund when you found another. Had you done that, you wouldn't be in this position.

I am ready to give up giving any more advice here but you need to forward the agents email admitting she erred in purchasing the policy for you to the agency manager and tell her the agent erred in purchasing the policy, you didn't cancel it (but you really did by asking for the refund. The agency owner is twisting your words).

I don't know if this is going to make your case any better or worse at this point. Was there a reason you waited until the very last minute to tell the agent you wanted the other policy? What was the difference in the Allianz policy vs. the one you decided you wanted to buy?

I am sure now you wished you had just left the Allianz policy in place.
I agree that if you have any chance against the travel agency itself, this is your best recourse.
This may sound like splitting hairs, but did you give her your credit card for the deposit late in the day? This can sometimes bump the transaction into the next business day, although you did say your credit card statement showed the proper date.
I'm still personally stumped as to why you would wait so long in the process to secure the insurance given the time sensitivity--an issue you were clearly aware of. I think you put yourself in an unnecessary position.
 
Aug 29, 2015
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#71
There is no reason to be mean and or rude with the poster. If you read the last page they clearly said "Yes, I have the credit card statement showing the initial cruise charge on 2/2/2015. Yes, I have the booking statement from Regent showing the initial deposit date of 2/2/2015."
More than 15 days had passed according to the insurance company so the insurance didn't cover their pre-existing condition. The isssue is that the travel company is denying any wrong doing and has incorrect facts, as indicated by the emails which the poster has.
I'm curious as to the 15 day rule and if this means 15 days or 15 working days, or 15 days, not counting holidays, etc.
In my experience, the 15 day rule is 15 calendar days. Other companies use 14, 21 or 30 days, depending on the level of service purchased. One company I have gotten a quote from allows the insurance to be purchased at final payment date for a cruise.

Since the credit card was charged on 2/2/2015 and the insurance was not paid for until 2/18/2015, the insurance company is correct to say that pre-existing conditions are not covered. February 18th was the 16th day, and therefore past the 15 days allowed to cover pre-existing conditions.

The issue now is to determine whether the sales agent and travel agency are liable, since the letter writer had communicated with the sales agent with a request to purchase the Silver level insurance policy. If the letter writer can show that she requested the insurance to be purchased before the sales agent went on vacation, as time and date stamped, and the agent failed to do so, the agency may be liable. However, since the agency states that their agent had an out of office reply on stating that she would return on 2/18, and the sales agent made the purchase on 2/18 of insurance, that shows the agent responded as soon as possible. One problem is that the agent quoted the dates incorrectly when she initially quoted the insurance, leading the purchaser to believe that 2/18 would be ok. Then the policy arrived and had the correct dates on it, and no thought was given.

I believe a court may end up involved here, since there is a considerable amount of dollars at stake, and a judge may have to determine who is at fault.
 

mmb

Verified Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,090
1,146
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#72
I believe a court may end up involved here, since there is a considerable amount of dollars at stake, and a judge may have to determine who is at fault.
If these TA's are a truly legitimate business entity, it is hard to understand why they don't just turn it over to their insurance entity. Methinks that the TA who works out of her house /under the umbrella of the larger agency/ has not been truthful about her actions and the woman who wrote the last letter toTobyR doesn't know the whole story I.e doesn't know that TobyR has emails that contradict the TA's version. JMHO.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
18,927
17,142
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#73
This is a remote possibility but the agent could have knowingly misstated the deposit date to try to get pre-ex coverage when the purchase went through a day late. But the insurance company may require a copy of the bank statement - which showed the policy wasn't purchased on time.
The real question is if the letter writer told the agent to purchase the insurance by the 16th of February. That is day 15 if the deposit was made on the 2nd - the second starts the count down as day 1. If she notified the agent on the 17th or 18 - that was too late. It is 15 CALENDAR days, not work days.
 
Jan 8, 2015
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#74
Neil, that is amazing that the day you purchase is actually counted as one day. To me a day is a 24 hour period, meaning that time on the third would be one day and so on. For it to be otherwise actually means it could be 14 days and one minute.
 
Likes: AAGK
Aug 29, 2015
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#75
If these TA's are a truly legitimate business entity, it is hard to understand why they don't just turn it over to their insurance entity. Methinks that the TA who works out of her house /under the umbrella of the larger agency/ has not been truthful about her actions and the woman who wrote the last letter toTobyR doesn't know the whole story I.e doesn't know that TobyR has emails that contradict the TA's version. JMHO.
My first response about turning it over to insurance is that the Travel Agency is trying to deal with it first, before it goes to insurance, in order to preserve their current premium status. Even if insurance does not pay out, turning over something to insurance is a potential strike against you that can raise your rates. Claim history, even when no payout is made, is a factor in premiums.
My statement regarding a judge becoming involved is because I believe it may be true. There is a series of events. If all contact was made, even in writing, and the time line can be substantiated in TobyR's favor, but TobyR knew the agent was going on vacation, then who should be responsible? Was the request to purchase insurance received and responded to by the agent before her vacation began? If so, saying she would handle it when she returned, if she knew the 15 day countdown clock was an issue, would be on the agent. If, however, TobyR received the out of office reply, she needed to contact another agent or the insurance directly.
 
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bodega3

Guest
#76
Neil, that is amazing that the day you purchase is actually counted as one day. To me a day is a 24 hour period, meaning that time on the third would be one day and so on. For it to be otherwise actually means it could be 14 days and one minute.
If you read the policy, it says 'within 15 days'. Within is the word that rules here. So you actually only have 14 days.
 
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bodega3

Guest
#77
My first response about turning it over to insurance is that the Travel Agency is trying to deal with it first, before it goes to insurance, in order to preserve their current premium status. Even if insurance does not pay out, turning over something to insurance is a potential strike against you that can raise your rates. Claim history, even when no payout is made, is a factor in premiums.
My statement regarding a judge becoming involved is because I believe it may be true. There is a series of events. If all contact was made, even in writing, and the time line can be substantiated in TobyR's favor, but TobyR knew the agent was going on vacation, then who should be responsible? Was the request to purchase insurance received and responded to by the agent before her vacation began? If so, saying she would handle it when she returned, if she knew the 15 day countdown clock was an issue, would be on the agent. If, however, TobyR received the out of office reply, she needed to contact another agent or the insurance directly.
We don't pay rates for insurance. If an agency has too many clients file claims, we get dropped from selling that company's coverage.
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Aug 29, 2015
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#78
We don't pay rates for insurance. If an agency has too many clients file claims, we get dropped from selling that company's coverage.
Bodega3, you mean for selling travel insurance? Interesting.

The comment I was responding to was about the insurance of the travel agency itself, or at least that was how I interpreted it. I know that legitimate travel agents carry E&O insurance. I interpreted mmb's comment about turning "it" over to their insurance as turning the claim over to the agency's E&O insurance, since TobyR has already been denied by the travel insurer, Travelguard.

My assumption, and I know that it is an assumption but it is based on my rental liability insurance premium, is that if there are claims against the agency's E&O liability insurance it can make a difference on the E&O insurance premium for the agency.

The issue here now is the timeline and communication sequence.
 
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bodega3

Guest
#79
Bodega3, you mean for selling travel insurance? Interesting.

The comment I was responding to was about the insurance of the travel agency itself, or at least that was how I interpreted it. I know that legitimate travel agents carry E&O insurance. I interpreted mmb's comment about turning "it" over to their insurance as turning the claim over to the agency's E&O insurance, since TobyR has already been denied by the travel insurer, Travelguard.

My assumption, and I know that it is an assumption but it is based on my rental liability insurance premium, is that if there are claims against the agency's E&O liability insurance it can make a difference on the E&O insurance premium for the agency.

The issue here now is the timeline and communication sequence.
I was referring to selling travel insurance since that is what this thread is about. Regarding E & O, most agencies try not to file a claim and just pay out of pocket if they have anything come up. E & O has gone up in rates (what hasn't!) even without any claims, so one claim and agencies live in fear of what their new rate would be.
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Aug 29, 2015
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#80
I was referring to selling travel insurance since that is what this thread is about. Regarding E & O, most agencies try not to file a claim and just pay out of pocket if they have anything come up. E & O has gone up in rates (what hasn't!) even without any claims, so one claim and agencies live in fear of what their new rate would be.
Thanks, I think we are on the same page now. :)

The initial issue was the travel insurance policy, but I don't believe it is that way any longer. The travel insurance was purchased, however the date it was purchased by the travel agent is after the 15 day pre-existing waiver time. As a result, Travelguard denied the claim, and has the documentation to support the denial based on the date the insurance was purchased with regard to the date the deposit on the cruise was made.

The issue now is the date the request for travel insurance was made, and basically who made the error.
 
Likes: Tricia K.
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