How to determine what to insure

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Jun 11, 2017
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#21
Thanks for these points of view.

As jsn55 expresses so artfully, “i could eat one night's hotel cost and the cancel/change airline fee.”

Neil.....I don’t mind “taking the gamble” of the hotel cancel penalty. I can afford to “eat” it.

MY CONCERN...is having the insurance company say.....in the event I needed to file a MEDICAL claim....that the entire policy is invalidated because I didn’t include that hotel penalty expense in my insurance application.

Unless I was taking an expensive pre-paid tour or cruise, I could be very happy with a travel insurance policy that covers ONLY medical insurance and evacuation. But I don’t know of any policies like that. I know Med-jet covers the evacuation. But I don’t know any company that offers the medical insurance just for foreign travel.

While I don’t have any upcoming trips that this hotel question would apply to, after reading this thread and giving it further consideration, I think in the future I will insure the 1-night hotel cancel penalty.

I once asked an insurance agent “How much insurance is enough insurance?”

His very sage reply was “”It’s enough Insurance when you can sleep at night.” Since that conversation, I’ve always followed this rule.

Thanks again for all the points of view.
 
Mar 17, 2015
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#23
I think it may depend on the plan you purchase and you need to ask the insurance provider this question. I can see the answer changing based on what you purchase. There is a Nationwide car insurance commercial that annoys me because a person complains that the insurance they have purchased does not cover new car replacement and the current insurance company says this is the policy you bought. The person complaining says it is the insurance provider, even though you have to purchase a specific coverage on top of the general insurance at Nationwide to have your new car covered. It is all in the details of the policy.
 
Jun 11, 2017
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#24
“. It is all in the details of the policy.”

Most definitely.

But find me an A-rated travel insurance policy that does NOT require ALL “non-refundable” expenses to be covered in the application or else the entire policy is not valid.

As far as the hotel cancel penalties are concerned, I think it boils down to what constitutes “non-refundable” if Hotel cancellations are allowed until 24- hours before arrival or even 6 pm on Day of arrival. (I realize many hotels are moving towards 48-72 hour late cancellation Windows.)

But then this presents another question.......Do I want to pay an insurance premium on a hotel reservation that is 8 months down the road when I can cancel the reservation pretty much at the last minute? Although.....I know Travelguard allows customers to add more expenses as you go along.

Some might say this is a very picky issue. However, “picky” is the nature of insurance contracts and legal contracts in general.
 
Jun 19, 2017
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#25
You can buy just medical coverage on many third party Travel insurance companies
Yes, but I also like higher amounts of Evacuation coverage, lost luggage, missed connections etc. Those are not covered as well by the credit card. Buying the minimum amount of trip cancelation/interruption ($200 to $500) affords me the maximum of those benefits.
 
Jun 11, 2017
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#26
Neil.....what do you mean “third party” medical coverage?

Are these reliable, well-rated companies?

Can I find them evaluated like on insuremytrip.com or squaremouth.com?
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
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www.promalvacations.com
#27
Neil.....what do you mean “third party” medical coverage?

Are these reliable, well-rated companies?

Can I find them evaluated like on insuremytrip.com or squaremouth.com?
Several insurers, such as TravelInsured, allow you to insurance just medical. Yes you can find them on insuremytrip and squaremouth.

The insurance company will not know what you insured and what you didn't if you never file a claim for what you didn't insure.
 
Jun 11, 2017
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#28
Thanks for this medical information, Neil.

Thankfully, I’ve never had to file a claim for anything. But I’m sure insurance companies don’t pay out big bucks without mounds of paperwork and all kinds of inquiries.

The insurance company will not know what you insured and what you didn't if you never file a claim for what you didn't insure.”

VERY Interesting to know this.

Without having any personal experience with this scenario (thankfully), I’ve always imagined a cross-examination by an insurance adjuster to find a loophole to avoid having to make a payout on a claim.

Thanks again for all of this information.
 
Jun 12, 2017
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#29
Several insurers, such as TravelInsured, allow you to insurance just medical. Yes you can find them on insuremytrip and squaremouth.

The insurance company will not know what you insured and what you didn't if you never file a claim for what you didn't insure.
Hello again,

Having just read the recent post, I think what I was asking in my original question was: If I don't put in a claim for the non-refundable hotel costs when making a claim with the other costs covered in policy(should I have a reason to make a claim), how would the insurance company know? Do they ask specific questions when a claim is made? Even in the case of the medical waiver used which requires 100% coverage, how would insurance company determine that I didn't include the hotel costs in the premium? If I were willing to eat the hotel costs, if for instance the medical care/evacuation was covered, what difference is it to the insurance company? Am I somehow cheating them?
 
Jun 11, 2017
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#30
Travelerinfrequent....an EXCELLENTLY stated question of my concern as well. I think it sums up the question and concern very clearly and perfectly.

Thank you.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
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www.promalvacations.com
#31
Hello again,

Having just read the recent post, I think what I was asking in my original question was: If I don't put in a claim for the non-refundable hotel costs when making a claim with the other costs covered in policy(should I have a reason to make a claim), how would the insurance company know? Do they ask specific questions when a claim is made? Even in the case of the medical waiver used which requires 100% coverage, how would insurance company determine that I didn't include the hotel costs in the premium? If I were willing to eat the hotel costs, if for instance the medical care/evacuation was covered, what difference is it to the insurance company? Am I somehow cheating them?
The insurance company wouldn’t know unless you had the hotels on documents you sent them. If you have separate reservations - they don’t know.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
12,789
12,762
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#33
Thanks for this medical information, Neil.

Thankfully, I’ve never had to file a claim for anything. But I’m sure insurance companies don’t pay out big bucks without mounds of paperwork and all kinds of inquiries.

The insurance company will not know what you insured and what you didn't if you never file a claim for what you didn't insure.”

VERY Interesting to know this.

Without having any personal experience with this scenario (thankfully), I’ve always imagined a cross-examination by an insurance adjuster to find a loophole to avoid having to make a payout on a claim.

Thanks again for all of this information.
In 17 years of doing my job we’ve only had one instance of an insurance claim not being paid and my wife told the the client the insurance company wasn’t going to cover the claim before he filed.

Six months before they were to travel to London, there was a subway bombing. But they booked anyway. As it came time to go, the wife suddenly got cold feet. My wife told him he didn’t have a cancel for any reason policy and if he canceled the claim was going to be rejected.

He was a pharmacist and said “I know a lot of doctors and I’ll get one to write my wife out due to sleep apnea”. We repeated that unless he had documentation that a dr.said she could not travel
due to sleep apnea it wasn’t going to be covered.

Six weeks later we got an angry call that his claim was denied. Why? The dr wouldn’t lie on the paperwork. He said the wife was afraid to fly and that based on that he recommended she not fly.

That then becomes a mental issue and is not covered by the insurance they had.

If a claim is legitimate and has medical records or the necessary records (death certificate, etc) claims are paid.

If you are lying or don’t have proper documentation- it’s declined.
 
Likes: ADM
Jun 19, 2017
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#35
“. It is all in the details of the policy.”

Most definitely.

But find me an A-rated travel insurance policy that does NOT require ALL “non-refundable” expenses to be covered in the application or else the entire policy is not valid.
Just for you I downloaded and read a random travel insurance policy from CF Travel Insured International, Worldwide Trip Protector Lite, rated A (Excellent) by AM Best Company. I tried to upload it as an attachment here but the server refused.

Nowhere in the policy it excludes coverage due to not buying a complete coverage. I can safely say that most of the mainstream travel insurance companies do not penalize you for not purchasing the full amount of coverage for their basic benefits (including medical).
All the policies that require full coverage do it in order for the Pre-Existing conditions to be waived, not for the basic health or other benefits.
CF Travel Insured International, Worldwide Trip Protector Lite policy doesn't offer a Waiver of Pre-Existing conditions.


The only two policies that I know of, that are less restrictive and do not require full coverage purchase for this waiver to be effective are Travel Guard Policy (for NY travelers) and TripAssure - a Trip Mate Brand.

Here is a quote from their policy:
Insure The Full Cost of Your Trip
If You have insured an amount less than 100% of the cost of all Travel
Arrangements that are subject to cancellation penalties or restrictions: 1)
the Maximum Benefit Amount for Trip Cancellation will be limited to the
amount of coverage You purchased; and 2) the Maximum Benefit Amount
for Trip Interruption will be 150% of the amount of coverage You purchased
 
Likes: jsn55
Jun 11, 2017
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#36
Reuven.....it is so incredibly kind of you to undertake this research. It is sincerely appreciated.

I DO need the pre-existing waiver. And I also need a policy where you have the option of choosing “evacuation to the medical facility of YOUR choice.” So that is another limiting condition when buying travel insurance.

While no one ever thinks “it” will happen to them.....I have several friends who required emergency orthopedic surgical care while on a trip....various broken bones. And one heart attack. Some had insurance. Some didn’t. It’s a lesson learned.

And I’ve gained so much insurance knowledge in these past few days.

Thank you again, Reuven, for your time and consideration in putting together this very useful information. Wishing you happy and HEALTHY travels always.
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
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#37
I use a different solution to all those concerns, and I recommend it to anyone who travels more than occasionally.
I have a credit card (Chase Sapphire Reserve) that has travel insurance coverage as one of its benefits. There are many banks that offer some kind of travel insurance with their free Visa cards.
I use that card, which automatically activates my coverage. I then buy a minimal coverage with a travel insurance company, which add the many benefits that are not available otherwise.
Some of the free Visa cards that offer Trip Cancellation limit the benefit to $1,500. In this case, I would recommend buying private insurance that completes the coverage needed.
From what I understand, policies are not invalidated because you did not buy 100% of your trip cancellation at risk - only certain provisions are. One I can think of is Waiver of pre Existing medical conditions. In New York, where I live, there are policies that cover you for that regardless of how much coverage you purchased.

If you are a traveler that travels once in a blue moon, buy a policy for 10% more than you think you will need and have peace of mind.
This is exactly how I manage it, Reuven. For anything outside the CSR's coverage, I buy travel insurance from a real human being with Travel Insurance in Omaha.
 

Patina

Verified Member
Dec 22, 2015
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#38
Just one perspective, not advice:

A year ago I filed a medical claim (which is what sounds like you are focused on @Tripgirl), the company required proof of payments that totaled the insured amount. So, based on our policy, I provided them with each receipt that added up to the total policy coverage......I did not include other items from our trip that may have been non-refundable, just the expenses that I insured. For example, if our policy was for $5000 in certain non-refundable expenses, I provided receipts that totaled $5000. I hope that makes sense.

There are so many situations that do not fit into a typical holiday; people may fly for free but pay the taxes, stay at a friend's mid-trip, camp, etc. The insurance company would never know what you may lose in non-refundable payments if you do not include it as part of a claim. In my case, I did not ask for reimbursement for any of the covered items, just the medical costs reimbursed. But they still required proof of these payments in order to finalize the medical reimbursement.
 
Jun 11, 2017
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#40
Good morning, Forum.

Patina... Thank you so much for your very valuable perspective.

Your explanation makes total sense.

I always have detailed receipts....down to the exact penny. And I would never make a claim for non-refundable losses I had not insured. Patina, You are very correct....I am most concerned about medical and evacuation coverage....especially when I have friends who can tell real horror stories about foreign medical emergencies.

When I’m taking an expensive group tour or a cruise, I always buy total coverage. But for my own modest independent trips, my non-refundable expenses are pretty negligible. However, I’ve always been concerned about making sure I don’t do anything to invalidate my insurance policy if I should need it in an emergency.

Jsn55.....It’s very possible I am mistaken.....but it’s my understanding that you can only buy insurance from a broker (real human being) who is licensed in the state where you live.

It’s great to be able to benefit from the experience of others. Insurance is probably the most expensive item you could ever buy that YOU HOPE YOU NEVER HAVE TO USE.
 
Likes: Neil Maley