Buyer Disputed a PayPal purchase, as the Seller what can I do?

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Feb 26, 2019
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#1
I'm at a bit of a loss -- I recently sold two tickets to an event to someone, and they paid me via the PayPal.

They used the tickets.

2 weeks after this, they filed a chargeback to PayPal (I guess, via their bank?).

PayPal then deducted the money that they deposited into my account and are keeping it while they wait for the decision by the buyers bank on whether they are going to process said chargeback. In the meantime, I got an email from PayPal that the reason they took back the money was because the tickets are "Intangible goods or services are not covered under Seller Protection". We have a copy of all the details of the transaction. And further, we actually CALLED PayPal support BEFORE we sent the tickets to ensure that the money that was sent was, in fact, deposited into our account (unfortunately, we don't have a copy of this call since, well, it was a call and we didn't think to record it!).

We have sent them (PayPal) proof that the tickets were used -- though obviously we have no idea if they were used by the actual person who bought them (or if he resold them -- or gave them away).

I guess I'm looking for advice on how to pursue this, and what, if anything, can be done it comes back that the buyers bank DID reverse the chargers and we're left holding the proverbial empty bag. Perhaps I am jumping the gun since we don't know the eventual outcome, but this was for a considerable amount of money that would be lost. And that's just irritating and a bit stressful.

-ce
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
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Dec 27, 2014
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www.promalvacations.com
#2
At this point you are going to have to sit and wait it out. What was the reason they gave for the chargeback? Does the buyers feedback have any indication of problems before? How do you know they used the tickets?

It doesn’t matter that you called PayPal before. They didn’t lie to you- the money WAS put in your account. The buyer seems to be slick and knew that the item wasn’t covered by PayPal seller protection and filed a chargeback after.

Your recourse if you lose the chargeback might be a small claims court lawsuit.
 
Likes: VoR61
Feb 26, 2019
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#4
We used PayPal as the payment vehicle, so there was no buyer (or seller) protection. We don't know why or how the person constituted the claim for the chargeback. No feedback (since it wasn't through Ebay).

We know they used the tickets because we called our ticket rep and they told us that they had been scanned in and used. Again, we don't know WHO used them, we just know that they were used.

It's been in limbo now for 6 days. Not sure how long it takes to figure this out.
 
Likes: PAMTHA

mmb

Verified Member
Jan 20, 2015
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#6
You can actually contact Paypal by phone and state your case. Then follow up with any proof you have in writing or photos. They have their own seller protection plan.
They have been very fair with me in cases of disputes both as buyer and seller.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
16,150
14,741
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#7
You can actually contact Paypal by phone and state your case. Then follow up with any proof you have in writing or photos. They have their own seller protection plan.
They have been very fair with me in cases of disputes both as buyer and seller.
The seller protection plan doesn’t cover intangible goods. The items also much be physically sent to the buyers address on file switch PayPal and prove delivery was received:

Online or physical documentation from a shipping company that includes:
Date of shipment
An address for the recipient that matches the shipping address on the Transaction Details page
An address for the recipient showing at least the city/state, city/country, or zip/postal code (or international equivalent).
Online or physical documentation from a shipping company that includes:
Date of delivery and ‘delivered’ status
An address for the recipient that matches the shipping address on the Transaction Details page
An address for the recipient showing at least the city/state, city/country, or zip/postal code (or international equivalent).
Signature confirmation, if the full amount of the payment including shipping and taxes exceeds a fixed amount (based on the currency of the payment) from the signature confirmation threshold table below. Signature confirmation is online documentation, viewable at the shipping company’s website, indicating that the item was signed for.
IMPORTANT: Your choice of carrier and shipment options with that carrier can have a big impact on your ability to meet the proof of delivery requirements. Please ensure, especially when shipping goods internationally, that your carrier can provide ‘delivered’ status at the correct address, or your Seller Protection claim may be denied.
 
Likes: VoR61

mmb

Verified Member
Jan 20, 2015
943
998
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#8
The seller protection plan doesn’t cover intangible goods. The items also much be physically sent to the buyers address on file switch PayPal and prove delivery was received:

Online or physical documentation from a shipping company that includes:
Date of shipment
An address for the recipient that matches the shipping address on the Transaction Details page
An address for the recipient showing at least the city/state, city/country, or zip/postal code (or international equivalent).
Online or physical documentation from a shipping company that includes:
Date of delivery and ‘delivered’ status
An address for the recipient that matches the shipping address on the Transaction Details page
An address for the recipient showing at least the city/state, city/country, or zip/postal code (or international equivalent).
Signature confirmation, if the full amount of the payment including shipping and taxes exceeds a fixed amount (based on the currency of the payment) from the signature confirmation threshold table below. Signature confirmation is online documentation, viewable at the shipping company’s website, indicating that the item was signed for.
IMPORTANT: Your choice of carrier and shipment options with that carrier can have a big impact on your ability to meet the proof of delivery requirements. Please ensure, especially when shipping goods internationally, that your carrier can provide ‘delivered’ status at the correct address, or your Seller Protection claim may be denied.
None of this precludes OP from calling Paypal and have a conversation.
 
Likes: VoR61

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
16,150
14,741
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#9
None of this precludes OP from calling Paypal and have a conversation.
Absolutely but our recommended method is do it all in writing. That’s the only way you have indisputable proof of what was said. Not a “he said, she said” situation.

There are only two reasons that the buyer can do a dispute- item not received, or item not as described. But PayPal requires delivery confirmation and that’s impossible to price unless you have an email service that shows the email was open if the tickets were emailed.

It’s unfair in my eyes- schemers know exactly how to play the system. I hope the OP prevails.
 

mmb

Verified Member
Jan 20, 2015
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#11
I’m only saying that a phone call could possibly give the OP some direction on how to proceed, much more quickly than waiting for the system to grind out emails with direction, which can often be confusing to the uninitiated.
A bedrock of business is to have a meeting or a phone conversation and follow it up with a documented meeting memorandum to clarify exactly what was discussed/decided.
If the OP has already started the process, a quick phone call can be very helpful to his understanding his options.
 
Likes: VoR61
Sep 19, 2015
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#12
I’m only saying that a phone call could possibly give the OP some direction on how to proceed, much more quickly than waiting for the system to grind out emails with direction, which can often be confusing to the uninitiated.
A bedrock of business is to have a meeting or a phone conversation and follow it up with a documented meeting memorandum to clarify exactly what was discussed/decided.
If the OP has already started the process, a quick phone call can be very helpful to his understanding his options.
MMB certainly that is how many businesses work but my fear is that the OP will end up in call center hell and not be able to get someone knowledgeable and able to give the proper guidance. Many of the call center people do not have external emails ...so any email verification of the conversation may end up in limbo.
 
Likes: VoR61

mmb

Verified Member
Jan 20, 2015
943
998
93
#13
MMB certainly that is how many businesses work but my fear is that the OP will end up in call center hell and not be able to get someone knowledgeable and able to give the proper guidance. Many of the call center people do not have external emails ...so any email verification of the conversation may end up in limbo.
Except that I have reported to you that I have had GOOD outcomes on both sides of this issue with the call center.
You can always hang up, try again and/or revert to email.
I haven’t insisted anyone follow my advice I’m just sayin’. ....
Not understanding why it is being so argued about. Take it or leave it. I never suggested he abandon the written route.
 
Apr 23, 2018
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#15
Nothing wrong with placing a call and letting the other end know you'll be recording the conversation for quality assurance purposes. "Quality assurance" includes preserving for the record what was said. You don't need a lot of technology, just a speakerphone and something else to pick up the conversation.
 
Feb 26, 2019
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#16
We have talked with PayPal, and their comment was "we are working with the buyers" bank to resolves this.

And, it wasn't resolved. We just got a nice email from PayPal:

Dear <xxx>,

We've been working with your buyer's financial institution to resolve the dispute for the transaction detailed below.

Buyer's name: D.... K........
Buyer's email: d.............@.........
Buyer's transaction ID: 6596.............
Your transaction ID: 7PT77............
Transaction date: January 22, 2019
Transaction amount: $2,060.00 USD
Disputed amount: $2,060.00 USD
After our efforts to resolve this dispute on your behalf, your buyer’s financial institution decided in the buyer’s favor.

While we cannot dispute this transaction any further, we encourage you to contact your buyer directly to reach a resolution.

Thank you for your patience during this process. We appreciate your business.

You can find additional information and tips about buying and selling safely on our Business Resource Center. After you log in to your PayPal account, click Tools, and then click Business Resource Center under "Grow your business."

Sincerely,

PayPal


I'm actually unsure what to do at this point. Will PayPal even give us more information about the buyer or their bank? I mean, we could take this to small claims court I guess, but how would we be able to do that? They say "contact the buyer directly" ... which I gather is via email. We will do that but if it's truly some scammer, then I can't imagine they will respond.

I'm seriously at a loss...
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
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San Francisco
#17
Except that I have reported to you that I have had GOOD outcomes on both sides of this issue with the call center.
You can always hang up, try again and/or revert to email.
I haven’t insisted anyone follow my advice I’m just sayin’. ....
Not understanding why it is being so argued about. Take it or leave it. I never suggested he abandon the written route.
You are absolutely right, mmb. It takes little effort to make a call ... and if there's no help, move on per our advice.