Admitted fraud - PayPal and Chase won’t get money back

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Dec 3, 2018
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#1
Hi!
In August someone took $1 from my savings account. With investment fluctuations, I did not notice this $1. 60 days later, this same person took out $1119.10 using PayPal from my savings account. Chase refuses to give the money back because it’s “after 60 days.” I called PayPal twice, they told me I would receive the money back from them and get an email with instructions 24/48 hours. Four days goes by and nothing. I call PayPal and two people hang up on me. Then the third person said we can only give the money to the bank, but the bank won’t give it to me. Help please, how do I get my money back :(
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#2
This is terrible some one added your account and scammed you.

The problem is that the law only protects a consumer if they notify the bank within 60 days of the statement:

“Also, if your bank or credit union sends your statement that shows an unauthorized debit, you should notify them within 60 days. If you wait longer, you could also have to pay the full amount of any transactions that occurred after the 60-day period and before you notify your bank or credit union. In order to hold you responsible for those transactions, your bank or credit union would have to show that if you notified them before the end of the 60-day period, the transactions would not have occurred.”

https://www.consumerfinance.gov/ask...r-money-missing-from-my-bank-account-en-1017/
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Dec 3, 2018
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#3
First, it's too convenient how someone knew to take $1 something so small I didn't notice it at first. But, that is what Chase said, so I contacted PayPal. Two people within the Fraud Department said they will credit the money back. But now nothing.. People are hanging up on me in PayPal and they are trying to make excuses after I was told "Yes it is a fraud, and yes we will credit your money back."
 
Dec 3, 2018
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#4
Plus I notified the bank the day after the $1119 was taken, but they will not credit that back. I don't care about the $1 in August, I care about the big charge in November I called right after it occurred.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#5
The problem is that the $1119 would not have happened had the $1 been noticed and reported.

How has PayPal responded if at all?
 
Dec 3, 2018
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#7
PayPal said they would since they confirmed that I was not the person to make any of the purchases. They said I would receive an e-mail last week within 24/48 hours from management identifying how the money should be credited back. I received nothing. Called tonight, was hung-up on twice, and then the last person was only able to "take notes on the conversation," for a supervisor to call me. This is ridiculous, and I have a lawyer already contacted for a potential customer service lawsuit.

I have not filed a police report, I do have the first and last name of the person who took the money though. But they would not provide me with any other information to narrow down where the person was when they took the money.
 
Mar 14, 2018
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#8
All that matters is when the disputed transaction occurred.

Tell the bank you are providing formal notice under Regulation E that there has been an unauthorized transfer from your account. Follow this up with a letter to the same effect.

The bank then has 10 business days to investigate after which they must either provisionally or permanently credit your account (unless they somehow determine that the transfer was authorized).
 
Dec 3, 2018
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#9
I sent a secure message to my bank identifying this, and will follow-up with a letter. I have been told by multiple people in both Chase and PayPal that it is fraud and someone will get my money back to me. But both places are turning it on the other and no one is taking action.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#10
All that matters is when the disputed transaction occurred.

Tell the bank you areproviding formal notice under Regulation E[/URL] that there has been an unauthorized transfer from your account. Follow this up with a letter to the same effect.

The bank then has 10 business days to investigate after which they must either provisionally or permanently credit your account (unless they somehow determine that the transfer was authorized).

SMD the link you gave just supports the bank’s position. From the link you provided:


(i) Is received by the institution no later than 60 days after the institution sends the periodic statement or provides the passbook documentation, required by § 1005.9, on which the alleged error is first reflected;


The alleged fraud and error started in August and more than 60 days has passed by the OPs own admission so quoting Schedule E will not help.


If PayPal refunds the money to the bank the bank should credit it to the OP.
 
Mar 14, 2018
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#11
The alleged fraud and error started in August and more than 60 days has passed by the OPs own admission so quoting Schedule E will not help.
I think this is completely incorrect. An error (defined in a.1 of the regulation) is an unauthorized transfer. Each unauthorized transfer is therefore its own error. There's nothing in the regulation that says the 60 day period begins when any unauthorized transfer occurs and then continues indefinitely after that.

Antone, I suggest you provide the Regulation E notice.
 
Likes: Mel65
Sep 19, 2015
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#12
I think this is completely incorrect. An error (defined in a.1 of the regulation) is an unauthorized transfer. Each unauthorized transfer is therefore its own error. There's nothing in the regulation that says the 60 day period begins when any unauthorized transfer occurs and then continues indefinitely after that.

Antone, I suggest you provide the Regulation E notice.






“Also, if your bank or credit union sends your statement that shows an unauthorized debit, you should notify them within 60 days. If you wait longer, you could also have to pay the full amount of any transactions that occurred after the 60-day period and before you notify your bank or credit union. In order to hold you responsible for those transactions, your bank or credit union would have to show that if you notified them before the end of the 60-day period, the transactions would not have occurred.“


That is from consumer finance protection—notice the point about waiting any longer than 60 days “you would have to pay the full amount....”
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#13
And Regulation E that you linked

“(i) Is received by the institution no later than 60 days after the institution sends the periodic statement or provides the passbook documentation, required by § 1005.9, on which the alleged error is first reflected;


The Error/ Fraud was first reflected in August; how can you claim that 60 days from the first fraud in August has not passed?
 
Mar 14, 2018
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#14
Looked into it some more and I now think Christina is right. On a series of transactions the bank is only liable for 60 days from the statement where the first fraudulent transaction is reported. The fraudster was pretty clever in how they did these transactions.

Your best hope for a refund is from Paypal. Wsa the fraudulent withdrawal made from your paypal account or a different account opened by the scammer?
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
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www.promalvacations.com
#15
First, it's too convenient how someone knew to take $1 something so small I didn't notice it at first. But, that is what Chase said, so I contacted PayPal. Two people within the Fraud Department said they will credit the money back. But now nothing.. People are hanging up on me in PayPal and they are trying to make excuses after I was told "Yes it is a fraud, and yes we will credit your money back."
This is how fraud is done- they start with $1, looking to see if you notice (which you didn’t) and then go for the big one.

How was PayPal used to take the money from your Chase account? Is your savings account linked to a PayPsl account?

Did you notify them right away when the $1100 was taken? Whoever did this knew exactly what they were doing because they waited 60 days to do the second transaction.

You must file a police report and send the report number to PayPal and Chase.

How did you get the name of the person that took the money? Do you know this person?
 
Dec 3, 2018
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#16
I think this is completely incorrect. An error (defined in a.1 of the regulation) is an unauthorized transfer. Each unauthorized transfer is therefore its own error. There's nothing in the regulation that says the 60 day period begins when any unauthorized transfer occurs and then continues indefinitely after that.

Antone, I suggest you provide the Regulation E notice.

I tried this morning and they told me it doesn’t matter. You can have the $1 from August but we won’t give you the $1119.10 that was taken in November when you reported it.
 
Dec 3, 2018
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#17
This is how fraud is done- they start with $1, looking to see if you notice (which you didn’t) and then go for the big one.

How was PayPal used to take the money from your Chase account? Is your savings account linked to a PayPsl account?

Did you notify them right away when the $1100 was taken? Whoever did this knew exactly what they were doing because they waited 60 days to do the second transaction.

You must file a police report and send the report number to PayPal and Chase.

How did you get the name of the person that took the money? Do you know this person?
I do not know the person, PayPal gave me the name when they were asking if it was me who made the charges. So I can make a police report with the name, and then provide that to chase and PayPal..? Would I just call my local police department to make the report.
 
Feb 16, 2018
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#18
Yes, call your local police department for a report. You will want to have all of the documents that show these transactions and correspondence. (If you have copies to give to them it will be helpful) You will ask them for a case number, which you can then provide to PayPal and Chase as your proof of filing a police report.
 
Likes: Neil Maley

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
14,599
13,724
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#19
The police department is probably going to give you a hard time too- but insist on a report being taken and a case number issued. Tell them that your credit card is requiring this. My wife had this happen and had to go down to the precinct and make the report.

But you are fighting an uphill battle because you never reported the August charge. By not reporting you basically authorized the transaction .
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#20
Somebody added the OPs savings account and PayPal never did any verification. Then the $1 transaction was done and waited, knowing very well that it is easy for someone not to notice $1. This is a more sophisticated fraudster than most as they waited the 60 days.

I am interested in hearing how PayPal can excuse this — could I add any unrelated bank account to a PayPal account?

Make a police report and see what PayPal has to say.