ACE threatened collection action plus additional 30% and lien

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Aug 7, 2017
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#21
So I got another email today again with the same threat. At this time I do not plan to respond and will look into filing a complaint with the attorney general's office. It is absurd that they threat to add 30% on top of the full amount. As Kahhss mentioned earlier, I doubt the legality of that threat. I am even considering just letting them send me to collection and just keep ignoring them (Probably not a smart thing to do. ha).
 
Aug 4, 2017
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#22
WOW, Renee, I am sorry that you are in the same position. It is not fair that they are doing this to us since the role of the insurance is to take care of those issues. They want to take the insurance money and then squeeze money out of us. I don't know what I should do yet but as you said the insurance really is of no help when it comes to the extra charges that they are not willing to pay. If ACE settled with the insurance, they should not come after us again! (well, mine was threatening not to take insurance's offer) I feel like we are being bullied as consumers and no protection for us.
Please keep me posted on your progress.... :(
Lynn, I am curious to know if you rented from the same Ace Rental in Aurora , the one at the Airport? Do try the Attorney General in Colorado, the website has a consumer protection complaint for. I will definitely keep you posted
 
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#23
Hi Renee,
Yes, it is the same ACE in Aurora, CO. I really think they are walking on the fence of doing abusive collection and illegal practice. They probably already sold the cars and just want double benefits from us. That's disgusting.
 
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#24
Hi Renee,
Yes, it is the same ACE in Aurora, CO. I really think they are walking on the fence of doing abusive collection and illegal practice. They probably already sold the cars and just want double benefits from us. That's disgusting.
Maybe Neil is right, a local Denver News Channel should look into this, or maybe these could result in some kind of a class action! Are you dealing with Rockport Auto claims at all?
 
Likes: Mel65
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#25
Yes. it is the Rockport claims according to the email address. So it seems that the did take your insurance company's offer eventually but still come after you for the remaining excessive amount. If they took your insurance's money, didn't that mean they signed a release from them to release you from further claims?
Apparently, they have been doing this kind of practice for who knows how long...Maybe we should think about writing to a local Denver news station together...
 
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Likes: Mel65
Aug 4, 2017
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#26
Yes. it is the Rockport claims according to the email address. So it seems that the did take your insurance company's offer eventually but still come after you for the remaining excessive amount. If they took your insurance's money, didn't that mean they signed a release from them to release you from further claims?
Apparently, they have been doing this kind of practice for who knows how long...Maybe we should think about writing to a local Denver news station together...
Lynne I did file a consumer complaint against Rockport Auto claims through my local Attorney General, they basically mediate. How I understand it is. we signed the contract at the time of the rental that does state, diminished value, loss of use, and Admin. fees. but they have no proof of these costs that they are asking for!! I tried contacting some local attorneys here in California. No help there! it think it is not worth it for them. I am hoping to talk to an attorney on Monday that would be willing to write some sort of a legal letter possibly threatening a possible law suit. I believe that these two companies are too small to support a law suit and are willing to settle for a reasonable price. Log on to the BBB and look at the complaints against Rockport Auto clams. they have only been in business 9 years and have 12 complaints against them regarding the same issues. I agree we need to stop these unscrupulous and unethical practices
 
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#27
Maybe I am too naive, but I still I think once they settle with the insurance, they should not come after us. If insurance doesn't pay the requested charges because they cannot provide proper documentation to support the charges, it is not our responsibility. Isn't it what insurance is for? It's to "settle" the claims....It just seems so scary that they can do whatever they want and we are a prey for them (and they can arbitrarily charge a 30% fee just because they wanted to?)
 
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#28
Lynn,
first of all, did you save the contract that was signed at the time of the rental. in section 5 clearly in very small print has all of these fees listed. which I believe you are bound to legally. Insurance Companies pay a certain amount that they believe is sufficient to cover the cost of the physical damages at least in my case. My Credit card co. .said they would help pay for the loss of use if they can get a "Fleet Utilization Log" which my credit card company requested from Rockport. Rockport said that they do not issue logs and they that had sent my credit card company all of the necessary paper work. in Turn my credit card company said unless they get that log they can not help pay for the loss of use, and they can not force them to produce just request it. this whole thing is SH::::::TY! I feel your pain. one thing I learned is that even if they send you to collections your response to collections as" this issue is still under a dispute and has not been settled," that way it will not ding your credit. So get as many complaints in as you can, throw every thing that you can at them, that way you have proof of dispute. Lynn please note I am not an expert, I am just sharing what I have learned so far and still in the learning process. We got to keep the fight!
 

Neil Maley

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#29
I find it fascinating that both of you rented from the same location and are finding the same problem. The fact you found each other here is nothing less than remarkable and I really think you should contact a consumer news station in that area and BOTH pounce on them to do a story to try to warn other about this location.

I also think you should both go up the executive chain at ACE because this is clear evidence this is their regular mode of operation.
 
Likes: Mel65
Aug 4, 2017
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#30
I find it fascinating that both of you rented from the same location and are finding the same problem. The fact you found each other here is nothing less than remarkable and I really think you should contact a consumer news station in that area and BOTH pounce on them to do a story to try to warn other about this location.

I also think you should both go up the executive chain at ACE because this is clear evidence this is their regular mode of operation.
I had contacted Ace Headquarters about obtaining a fleet log, they told me that that particular Ace Rent A Car is individually owned and operated, but the fact that it still is under the Ace name might carry some weight even if just writing a letter to corporate. you should also google Ace and see all of the complaints I think there was 221. This whole has issue consumes alot of my time and energy, I try to abstain from the issue for a few days. Then on my days off, which are Mon and Tue. I will devote a certain amount of time to phone calls and letter writing Last Friday I called my local news investigative channel and of course never heard back form them! but yes thanks for the feedback
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Aug 4, 2017
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#32
I came across a few interesting articles in a publication called "Auto Rental News" this magazine is written for anyone that owns a rental cat fleet or involved in the industry. One of the articles is titled "8 tips in Recovering Loss of Use and Administrative Fees" it outlines their approach that is supposedly reasonable and fair, and that there is some in the business that do not follow these guidelines and give the rental car business a bad name. the other article is Damage Claims: An Accident Waiting to Happen. this one was published in 2014. Unfortunately I was having trouble providing the link. Just google the Auto Rental News.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
12,772
12,753
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#33
I came across a few interesting articles in a publication called "Auto Rental News" this magazine is written for anyone that owns a rental cat fleet or involved in the industry. One of the articles is titled "8 tips in Recovering Loss of Use and Administrative Fees" it outlines their approach that is supposedly reasonable and fair, and that there is some in the business that do not follow these guidelines and give the rental car business a bad name. the other article is Damage Claims: An Accident Waiting to Happen. this one was published in 2014. Unfortunately I was having trouble providing the link. Just google the Auto Rental News.
Maybe our writer should send this to Ace.

http://m.autorentalnews.com/article/4506/8-tips-in-recovering-loss-of-use-and-administrative-fees

There are actually some things in here you could try asking them to show you know more than they think. Like asking them for proof every other car they had was rented during the time they claim loss of use (although they don't have to provide that).
And find out if loss of use claims are even legal in the state you rented in.

I also notice the articke was written by the owner of Purco one of the biggest problems we have here.
 

Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
12,772
12,753
113
New York
www.promalvacations.com
#34
I came across a few interesting articles in a publication called "Auto Rental News" this magazine is written for anyone that owns a rental cat fleet or involved in the industry. One of the articles is titled "8 tips in Recovering Loss of Use and Administrative Fees" it outlines their approach that is supposedly reasonable and fair, and that there is some in the business that do not follow these guidelines and give the rental car business a bad name. the other article is Damage Claims: An Accident Waiting to Happen. this one was published in 2014. Unfortunately I was having trouble providing the link. Just google the Auto Rental News.
This is actually a fascinating website. Many interesting articles from the other side, especially about chargebacks- the car rental company has one of the highest credit card dispute rates. And one thing they mention to avoid chargebacks is to thoroughly inspect cars at return and when re renting. Which is where most of the issues come from
 
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#35
This is actually a fascinating website. Many interesting articles from the other side, especially about chargebacks- the car rental company has one of the highest credit card dispute rates. And one thing they mention to avoid chargebacks is to thoroughly inspect cars at return and when re renting. Which is where most of the issues come from[/QUO
 
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#36
what I did like about these articles, is that they are aware that there are a few operators who cross the line and give the whole rental car industry a bad name.and they feel that with all of the negativity surrounding these issues, there is will be more regulatory standards put in place which is exactly what they do not want! and the Purco vs Koeing case. the reason why the rental car company won is that they had proof of those costs and they were reasonable, not grossly inflated!
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Feb 9, 2016
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#37
Ladies, we used to have a professional lawyer contribute to this site. Im going to re post some of his comments on your specific topics.

I will say that, if your insurance company has agreed to review any fees as long as the rental car company turns over XYZ documentation, then you need to reflect that sentiment every time those fees are brought up.

Absolutely! My insurance company is happy to take into consideration your claim for X fee, Y fee and Z fee, and pay the claim. At this point they have requested A documentation, B documentation and C documentation in order to validate that claim. Once you have supplied the requested documentation, they will work with you to drop the claim. As I understand it, you possess said documentation but will not disclose it, such that the payment can be made. At this time I am asking you to turn over the documentation so that part of the claim can be settled, or drop this matter entirely.

Or some variation of that. it's important to acknowledge the fees they are asking for and document that these fees will most likely be paid by insurance if the cooperate. And be pleasant about this fact, almost excited.
 
Feb 9, 2016
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#38
Joe's advice on when a car rental company tries to come back and get you to pay any fees that your insurance company didn't. He's basically saying it's your insurance companies job to protect you with a damage release form when they pay

Comment on Insurance:

Just because carriers do not cover loss of future value does not mean that at the time they pay damages on your behalf they should not protect your legal rights. A carrier that does NOT obtain a full and complete property damage release [at a minimum] at the time they pay a third party claim is opening the door to later claims from others or different claims just like this one someone makes later.

If the carrier did not obtain a release, then they are on the hook to defend you from this claim even though it may not be covered. You will likely get refusal to defend from the carrier on the grounds the the loss claimed is not a covered losss. The response to that is:

"I received your refusal to defend this claim. I filed claim # in good faith, relying on my insurance carrier to protect my interests.

Inexplicably, knowing about this claim, you paid money on this claim yet did not insist nor obtain a complete release of property damage claims at a minimum, at the time you paid the claim. This leaves me exposed to additional damages and having to fund this defense.

Obtaining a release prior to paying a claim is Insurance Adjusting 101. Your failure to do so violates our insurance contract, the covenant of good faith and fair dealing and is an astonishing bad faith claims settlement practice. I insist that my carrier protect my rights. The original claim was covered. The extra damages being sought here are part of the original claim which you failed to obtain a release for. A defense is demanded. Reserve whatever rights to payment you may need but I am entitled to a defense given your failure to obtain a release."
 
Likes: jsn55
Feb 9, 2016
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#39
NOTE that Joe tended to come at his advice from the angle of - invite them to sue you because, if they sue you EVERYTHING a things they are refusing to provide you as proof right now, it all becomes relevant when the venue switches to court.

The letter Joe said to send if the car rental company tries to come back and get those additional fees


"I reject your claim for additional damages. I invite you to sue me for the difference you claim since that is the only way I will pay. As I have previously noted, you have not proven the loss of use or diminution of value to a preponderance of the evidence. This is the reason that my insurance has refused to pay you. Sending a demand with a dollar number is not evidence. It is your conclusion as to reduced value.
"I remind you yet again that the rental agreement contains a mutual attorneys fee clause. And if you are not successful I will seek recovery of my attorneys fees. Your adamant refusal to provide actual evidence of loss of use by providing utilization logs, repair records and purchase cost, and how you computed diminution of value means you will not recover these damages simply from your refusal to provide the evidence.
"I specifically deny that I have damaged you in excess of the amounts paid to date. I invoke all rights under the Fair Credit Billing and Collection Act and demand that you cease further contact. If you wish to sue me, you know where to find me."

Now- you have defense coverage under your auto insurance policy for property damage to others - which is what this claim will be. Simply TENDER the defense to your insurance company. Since they have already denied coverage for them not proving the damage - they'll defend it - AMEX may as well. Tender it to them as well.
 
Likes: jsn55
Feb 9, 2016
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#40
Joe's suggested response to a car rental company trying to get a diminished value payment

Dear Purco:
We deny your claim since you cannot prove damages. The vehicle is already a rental and has diminished value the result of being used in fleet operations. Evidence of bad faith is a lack of adjustment for that part of the claim at the outset.

We deny we have damaged Budget in excess of the value of the repairs, which have already been paid.

We rely on the decision of our insurance company to deny your claim for further damages. We contend we owe you and your principal zero further damages. We revoke any consent to charge our credit card previously given.

We remind you that the contract contains an attorneys fee clause which is made mutual by the laws of both Hawaii and our state of residence. You cannot prove diminution of value nor can you prove loss of use damages, thus, we deny owe you anything. The contact provides for payment of those damages if you can prove them to a preponderance of the evidence. Our insurance carrier rejected your claim, which proves to us your further claims are without merit.

If you wish to sue us, please do so, in this manner we can resolve this claim. I remind Purco once again that we will seek full indemnification if you bring a further claim and are unsuccessful.
 
Likes: jsn55