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May 10, 2018
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#1
I purchased a new 2018 EcoSport from Olathe Ford in Kansas on April 11th 2018. When I went to purchase the car and fill out the paperwork I gave them my driver's license which says Florida. Which is my main residence and Kansas is my second residence. They gave me the option of registering the car in Florida or Kansas. They told me that Florida had a lower tax rate and that it would be better to register it in Florida so I agreed, I ask them what I would need to register it down here to make sure that it was done properly. They told me all I needed was my insurance(which is KS) my driver's license and the paperwork from the purchase. I went to the DMV here in Palatka Florida to register the vehicle and was told by DMV that I would need a second insurance, FL insurance and that I would have to pay about $2,500 to have this car registered which I do not have. Olathe Ford told me it would be about $1,900 so I set aside $2000.00 for that. I contacted Olathe Ford to see if they could amend the contract to add the KS taxes to the contract they refused to work with me and pretty much told me I was up a creek. So I contacted Ford Credit which is who I went through to purchase the car and they told me that the dealership could amend the contract that it would be no problem for Ford Credit but it would have to go through the dealership for them to amend it. Since Olathe Ford does not want to work with me and will not help me I went to a local Ford dealership here in Palatka, Beck Ford, salesman James May, they also told me that Olathe Ford could amend the contract to have those taxes added on and they don't understand why in the world Olathe Ford gave me the MSO on this car and that they should not have given me the MSO and that Olathe Ford completely dropped the ball on this deal. I tried to work with Beck Ford but since they did not do the contract and sale they cannot amend it only Olathe Ford can. Beck Ford offered to buy the car back, at my loss, and put me in a 2018 Ford Escape which would be more money, which I do not have. Plus a longer note. My home was practically destroyed by Irma and I have been putting every penny I can back into this house to make it livable and it's still not livable. I am having to rent a place to live until my home is livable again. FEMA only gave me 1000.00 to fix my home that didnt even cover the siding. I had to get a new roof and and the inside was almost totally gutted. The only thing I have in it is a bathroom. So I cannot afford a higher payment but I need this vehicle I have no other vehicle. Adding the tax on the contract would not cause that much bigger of a payment for me. I really like this car and want to keep it, it's a great car and we have bought so many vehicles from Ford. I really need to get these taxes somehow put on to the contract whether it's registered here in Florida or in Kansas. And once again I was told through Ford Credit that it can be done and they wouldn't have a problem doing that they just need to get the amended contract from Olathe Ford. They have nothing to do with contracts it comes from the dealerships. I am a single disabled woman that takes care of my disabled son plus having to get my home repaired, I cannot afford the $2,500 cash to get it registered in Florida or more to get it registered in Kansas, plus new FL insurance. I really need this contract amended. When I purchased the car on April 11th in Kansas they gave me a 60-day tag. In the State of Florida its only a 30 day which I am coming up on my 30-day and will be riding around with no tags on this vehicle, because I can't get it registered which will be illegal. I will also end up having to pay penalties. If there is any way for either of you to help me I would appreciate it. PLEASE PLEASE , I am not asking for anything free here, I hope you realize that.
This is the letter I emailed to the corporate emails I found on this site.
Thanks if anyone can help.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
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#2
I am completely at a loss here. A vehicle needs to be registered in the state of your legal residence. It needs to be insured wherever you live. If you spend lots of time somewhere else, that does not affect the car's registration or insurance at all. It all swings on your legal residence. It sounds like the KS dealer gave you an estimate of Florida registration costs and the costs are $600 higher. That's a cost of owning a vehicle. I doubt if they'll re-write a contract on a sold vehicle. I wish I could be more help.
 
Jun 30, 2017
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#3
I am completely at a loss here. A vehicle needs to be registered in the state of your legal residence. It needs to be insured wherever you live. If you spend lots of time somewhere else, that does not affect the car's registration or insurance at all. It all swings on your legal residence. It sounds like the KS dealer gave you an estimate of Florida registration costs and the costs are $600 higher. That's a cost of owning a vehicle. I doubt if they'll re-write a contract on a sold vehicle. I wish I could be more help.
You do not have to register a vehicle in your state of legal residence. I am a legal resident of Hawaii. I have a second home in Colorado where I garage, register and insure two vehicles. Many second home owners do this all the time.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#4
I also do quite understand. Where will the car be spending most of its time? If it is in FL, the insurance has cover the minimums and it needs to be from an agent in state.

The car should be registered and insured in the location where it will "reside -- and in FL the law is that if the car spends more than 90 days in the state it needs to be registered there and it has to have insurance from an insurance agent in the state of Florida.

Will the car spend more than 90 days per year in Florida? If Florida is truly your main residence and the car will spend more than 90 days there it needs to be registered there.

Sales tax and car registration issues are not simple and the car dealer may not want to amend something because that may cause tax authorities to investigate.

Ford Credit knows nothing about the local sales and car registration tax issues == if so they would not tell you that it is ok to have the car registered in KS if your primary residence is FL and the car spends more than 90 days per year there ( and the 90 days do not have to be consecutive).

From the Florida Highway and DMV

http://www.flhsmv.gov/ddl/frfaqgen.html

Any person who has a vehicle in Florida for more than 90 days during a 365-day period must purchase personal injury protection and property damage liability insurance coverage. The 90 days do not have to be consecutive.

I would urge you to carefully review the laws and regulations where you live and drive. trying to play games to minimize costs of sales taxes and car insurance can cause serious problems.

And it easy for another dealer to tell you what the KS dealer should have done when they are trying to get you to turn in a car bought one month ago for a loss.
 
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Neil Maley

Moderator
Staff Member
Advocate
Dec 27, 2014
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www.promalvacations.com
#5
We asked our snowbird friends in Florida about this- they told us that you have to live in Florida at least 6 months to be considered a resident and be able to register the car that way.

I think the dealer gave you lousy advice to make a sale.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#6
The car dealer may not want to change the invoice because they may have already filed the sales tax return with the state of MO for the month of April— they likely have to file monthly.

I would urge the OP to check the rules on where the car will be residing — and if it is more than 90 days in FL the car must be registered and insured in the state of FL.
 
Jan 30, 2018
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#7
I am not sure the following (from the link referenced above) means you must have FLORIDA insurance:

"I am not a resident of Florida but I have business that keeps me in Florida sometimes for several months at a time. Must I comply with Florida's insurance laws?
Yes. Any person who has a vehicle in Florida for more than 90 days during a 365-day period must purchase personal injury protection and property damage liability insurance coverage. The 90 days do not have to be consecutive."

I don't think you can even get Florida insurance unless the car is registered in Florida and why would you do that unless Florida is your legal residence?

We were snowbirds for years and our cars were registered and insured in Virginia, our legal residence.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#8
FL motor vehicle and insurance laws require an insurance policy written and sold by a FL agent for a car. A FL non resident who has a car that spends more than 90 days in the state needs to have the car registered and insured in FL.

People in NYC that go to FL for winter and leave their car in FL have to have FL plates and insurance even if they are residents elsewhere. NY is fairly aggressive in verifying part year resident income tax filings—- NY resident is someone who has a home and spends 184 or more days here. They are still NYC residents by law, but still have to have FL insurance because FL requires insurance for a car in the state more than 90 days, resident or not.

Those are the current regulations. How much they are enforced and how much people follow the law is another matter.

I am a resident of NY and have a car in another state, and the car stays there and it is insured and licensed in that state.
 
Likes: Neil Maley
Jan 30, 2018
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#9
Seems nutty to me - I would think that the residency state would have something to say about that! They would certainly want the registration revenue of a state resident. Oh, well, lots of laws make little sense.
 

technomage1

Verified Member
Jan 5, 2015
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#10
You're not military or dependent are you? There are exemptions for them. I was an Ohio resident yet lived all over the world and could have my car registered in Ohio or whereever I was stationed.

Have you heard back from corporate yet? If not, reengage, but only send to the first email on the list and drop the last half of your email about Irma, disability, etc. Regradless of circumstances you need to be able to register your car and you're asking the KS dealer to amend the contract.

I think you're barking up the wrong tree, though and really need to do the math. You have paid FL taxes and have a FL driver's license, by most definitions you are a FL resident. You need to get FL insurance to register in there anyway, the DMV is 100% correct there. Swap the insurance over would be my suggestion - and ask the insurance co if you need Kansas coverage instead when you go there.

You've got sales tax and personal property tax in KS, so you need to take both into account when estimating the cost. FL its costs $420 to register and title plus sales tax, which is 6% of the price less trade in, however they do not have at the state level a yearly property tax on the car. I think the dealer might very well be right when they say FL is cheaper, especially in the long haul.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#11
NY does not care I have a car in another state as the car has never entered NY and never will. If I brought the car to NY eventually I would get questioned on the out of state plates if I am stopped.

I do not think anyone is doing sweeps against out of state drivers my concern would be insurance not paying in case of an accident —

FL says they have to have FL insurance because the FL agents have to report the insurance to the DMV and the FL police can only access FL info...

I think it has to do with minimum insurance requirements and the issue of under or non insured drivers.
 
Jan 30, 2018
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#12
I certainly have never seen anything on my auto insurance policy that says it will not pay for accidents that happen out of state.

And, yes, if I am a legal resident of whatever state and have to register my car in Florida because I drive it for 91 days in Florida, my home state might have issue with that. They want the revenue!
 

technomage1

Verified Member
Jan 5, 2015
1,982
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#13
Speak to your insurer if you spend over 30 days out of state. They’ll be able to tell you what you need. You don’t want to go penny wise and pound foolish.

But regardless of that to register it in FL they’re going to want FL insurance. I had a car registered to VA and drove it in Guam, had Guam rates,

And like I noted, do the math and figure out what is truly cheaper here, KS with its yearly property tax or FL with its one time up front cost. I worry you’re about to make a costly, long term mistake here.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#14
I certainly have never seen anything on my auto insurance policy that says it will not pay for accidents that happen out of state.
And, yes, if I am a legal resident of whatever state and have to register my car in Florida because I drive it for 91 days in Florida, my home state might have issue with that. They want the revenue!
OTE="LDVinVA, post: 82362, member: 10184"]I certainly have never seen anything on my auto insurance policy that says it will not pay for accidents that happen out of state.
And, yes, if I am a legal resident of whatever state and have to register my car in Florida because I drive it for 91 days in Florida, my home state might have issue with that. They want the revenue![/QUOTE]

What one technically has to do in a situation like that is have florida plates and insurance for 91 days and then surrender the plates and leave --
It is really complicated in FL ---- and of course every state is different and has different minimum requirements for insurance.

The issue of having an accident out of state is if the insurance company believes that one made the choice for lower rates and did not follow the law. If I take a car from NYC to Maine, and have NY insurance, and just stay in Maine for vacation, no problem. But if I register the car in Maine and have the insurance in Maine, but keep and drive the car in NYC and it resides in NYC, then there may be a problem if there is an accident -- as it would be easy to suggest that the only reason I to register and insure in Maine is because the premiums are cheaper. And that would give the insurance company a reason to deny my claim.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#15
Here is information on that:

Your auto insurance rates are determined based on where your car is housed. By misrepresenting where your car is garaged, you run the risk that the insurer in your home state "could deny claims, stating misrepresentation about where the car was located," Gusner says.
It's considered premium fraud or rate evasion, says Frank Scafidi, spokesman for the National Insurance Crime Bureau (NICB). Your insurer will typically investigate your claim, or hand it off to the NICB for investigation.


https://www.insurance.com/auto-insurance/explained/car-insurance-coverage-for-snowbirds.aspx
 

jsn55

Verified Member
Dec 26, 2014
6,266
6,335
113
San Francisco
#16
Well I've certainly learned something here! Talk about a can of worms. It seems logical that your legal residence state wants the revenue, but obviously it's more complex than that. Sorry I gave out wrong advice.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#17
Well I've certainly learned something here! Talk about a can of worms. It seems logical that your legal residence state wants the revenue, but obviously it's more complex than that. Sorry I gave out wrong advice.
JSN55 the only reason I know this is because of having a car in another state and dealing with insurance issues. I will never bring the car to NYC, there is no way I could afford to park it, and it is far away so it will not be entering NY state. It is complicated.....
 
Sep 22, 2015
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#18
I purchased a new 2018 EcoSport from Olathe Ford in Kansas on April 11th 2018. When I went to purchase the car and fill out the paperwork I gave them my driver's license which says Florida. Which is my main residence and Kansas is my second residence. They gave me the option of registering the car in Florida or Kansas. They told me that Florida had a lower tax rate and that it would be better to register it in Florida so I agreed, I ask them what I would need to register it down here to make sure that it was done properly. They told me all I needed was my insurance(which is KS) my driver's license and the paperwork from the purchase. I went to the DMV here in Palatka Florida to register the vehicle and was told by DMV that I would need a second insurance, FL insurance and that I would have to pay about $2,500 to have this car registered which I do not have. Olathe Ford told me it would be about $1,900 so I set aside $2000.00 for that. I contacted Olathe Ford to see if they could amend the contract to add the KS taxes to the contract they refused to work with me and pretty much told me I was up a creek. So I contacted Ford Credit which is who I went through to purchase the car and they told me that the dealership could amend the contract that it would be no problem for Ford Credit but it would have to go through the dealership for them to amend it. Since Olathe Ford does not want to work with me and will not help me I went to a local Ford dealership here in Palatka, Beck Ford, salesman James May, they also told me that Olathe Ford could amend the contract to have those taxes added on and they don't understand why in the world Olathe Ford gave me the MSO on this car and that they should not have given me the MSO and that Olathe Ford completely dropped the ball on this deal. I tried to work with Beck Ford but since they did not do the contract and sale they cannot amend it only Olathe Ford can. Beck Ford offered to buy the car back, at my loss, and put me in a 2018 Ford Escape which would be more money, which I do not have. Plus a longer note. My home was practically destroyed by Irma and I have been putting every penny I can back into this house to make it livable and it's still not livable. I am having to rent a place to live until my home is livable again. FEMA only gave me 1000.00 to fix my home that didnt even cover the siding. I had to get a new roof and and the inside was almost totally gutted. The only thing I have in it is a bathroom. So I cannot afford a higher payment but I need this vehicle I have no other vehicle. Adding the tax on the contract would not cause that much bigger of a payment for me. I really like this car and want to keep it, it's a great car and we have bought so many vehicles from Ford. I really need to get these taxes somehow put on to the contract whether it's registered here in Florida or in Kansas. And once again I was told through Ford Credit that it can be done and they wouldn't have a problem doing that they just need to get the amended contract from Olathe Ford. They have nothing to do with contracts it comes from the dealerships. I am a single disabled woman that takes care of my disabled son plus having to get my home repaired, I cannot afford the $2,500 cash to get it registered in Florida or more to get it registered in Kansas, plus new FL insurance. I really need this contract amended. When I purchased the car on April 11th in Kansas they gave me a 60-day tag. In the State of Florida its only a 30 day which I am coming up on my 30-day and will be riding around with no tags on this vehicle, because I can't get it registered which will be illegal. I will also end up having to pay penalties. If there is any way for either of you to help me I would appreciate it. PLEASE PLEASE , I am not asking for anything free here, I hope you realize that.
This is the letter I emailed to the corporate emails I found on this site.
Thanks if anyone can help.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
I am a retired cop from Minnesota with 30 years on the job. All of this license and insurance info stated here is, for the most part, malarkey.
All 50 states belong to what is known as the "Drivers license and Registration Compact and reciprocity Act". Simply put, this means that each state recognizes each other state's laws regarding drivers license and vehicle registration and insurance. As long as you are compliant in your home state you are considered to be compliant in whatever state you pass through or spend time in. This certainly applies to "snowbirds" who go south for the winter.
The issue of where you are are a legal resident usually has to do with if you reside for 6 months and one day in a state you might be considered a resisent of that state but there are aother factors involved there.
 
Sep 19, 2015
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#19
Paladin1758 I respectfully disagree. I posted information from the official page of the Florida Highway Safety and DMV official government page which states that a non resident has to register and insure a car with FL agent if the car is in FL for over 90 days (not consecutive).

Laws change and different states have different rules.

And the person in this case admits that the main residence is in FL and car is in FL and wanted to change sales invoice back to MO (2nd home) because of insurance costs.
 
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Sep 22, 2015
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#20
I do not doubt what you say but there has to be a misinterpretation here somewhere. If that were true can you imagine how many hundreds of thousands of snowbirds are in violation of Florida law? State laws has many exceptions and/or chapters that apply to only specific situations. I am going to research this further.
I read the link you provided and it does indeed state that. However, I have sent an inquiry to the Florida Attorney Generals office for clarification.
If I receive a reply I will post it